Some suggested features from a disappointed new user

26 Okt 2017 12:09 - 26 Okt 2017 12:15 #1 von 185skywagon
Hello Jeti.

I recently purchased a DS-16 few months ago as an upgrade to another very common brand. I also purchased a whole bunch of Jeti receivers for most of my large scale models. Although (and I must make this clear) there are many aspects I love about the Jeti Duplex system, there are also a few that I find frustrating and have caused me to regret my purchase. In fact, I am trying to sell my system. Though I do not mean for this post to be a complaint session, I just hope that perhaps you could add a few very basic programing features in particular to help people like me who have come from other brands where these sorts of things are very basic and simple.

The major frustrations I'm having, is setting up new models. I have had the unit for a few months and have spent MANY hours learning its programing logic, I'm just frustrated that some things are quite difficult, and although the system can do them, there seems to be a few ways and in some cases requires tricking or "fooling" the system in order to get what you want. Programing should simply not be this hard.

For example. What about a basic flap system setup menu. You have things like a butterfly menu but how about one for flaps. Many fixed wing aircraft have them, most if not all other transmitters on the market have a simple flap setup menu for this extremely common function. Surely you could have a menu where you can select (obviously) the channel, the switch or slider, the degree of flap deflection for different positions (particularly for a 3-position switch), the deployment speed, and elevator mixing for different flap settings.

How about a proper ability to set up a knife edge mix. Maybe a separate menu setup page or whatever but it needs to have to ability to SIMPLY program to an amount of rudder we require an amount of aileron and an amount of elevator. Most importantly, this must be able to be ASYMMETRICAL !! This is particularly for propeller driven aircraft and I shouldn't need to educate anyone here, but due to propeller slip-stream and torque you are (almost) never going to have the same knife edge mix for one direction as you do the other. (ok fine there are some aircraft that can do it but it's not all that common).
This is perhaps the single most frustrating aspect to the Jeti duplex system for me hence why I am trying to sell it. I have invested a few thousand dollars in this quality high performance radio system but I have to use a $500 radio on most of my $10000 aerobatic aircraft because I can no longer fly "nice" knife edges with the Jeti. Of course I have rudder to elevator and rudder to aileron mixes set up but they only favor one direction of knife edge, because so far (in my learnings) it is not possible to have different variation of elevator an aileron mixes with a different direction of rudder deflection from center. This is certainly a basic and easy function on my "cheap" radios and many others. I'm certainly not saying it can't be done, but I haven't worked it out yet, the manual gives no guidance and even so, If I can manage to "fool" the system into giving me what I want, should it really be that difficult ?

Thank you for listening, I'm sorry for writing a negative post. I will continue "trying" with my jeti, as long as I still have it, though I am close to giving up. There are other setup issues I would like to see made easier but there are also some that are very easy and practical as well. There are many aspects to the radio which I love, and I would like to wave the flag for jeti in my part of the world (extremely uncommon in my country, not even a dealer) but how can I when I can't get the radio to effectively program to my aircraft.

Have a nice day everyone.

185.



P.s. Suggest add a wing type, two flaps one aileron (for those that use ailerons on one channel with a Y-lead)

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26 Okt 2017 12:39 #2 von lxfly
Sorry for frustration, but reading your post I think you didn't get all the philosophy of the Jeti system.

- Setting up a model is quite forward and I know a lot of elder people that use it with satisfaction.
- The Butterfly mixer is a flap mixer that almost has all the features you want, just use it the right way.
- Asymmetrical mixes may be done with no problems, just use the mixer curves.

Don't sell, just try to get the info and knowledge, you made a good choice.

Gruß
René
Folgende Benutzer bedankten sich: Jürgen, smartrobert

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26 Okt 2017 15:25 - 26 Okt 2017 16:17 #3 von FuniCapi
Hello

I really don't get your point about flaps. It's all there already. Maybe you have get more into flight modes.
Did you read this already:
www.jetimodel.com/en/DC-16-amp-DS-16-1/S...-1-Setup-of-a-Model/
www.jetimodel.com/en/DC-16-amp-DS-16-1/S...Part-2-Flight-Modes/
www.jetimodel.com/en/DC-16-amp-DS-16-1/S...-Model-Part-3-Mixes/

These are examples for a F3B glider, but it's exactly the same for a motor plane.

The knife edge mix is also very simple. Just switch to a V-shaped mix in the menu Free Mixers > Mixer Curve > Curve type.
After that you can move the very left and right point of the curve up and down independently to adjust to asymmetrical mix ratio.

P.S. Just use the wing type 2 Ailerons/2 Flaps and assign only the Aileron 1 function to only one servo channel.

Lukas
Folgende Benutzer bedankten sich: Jürgen, 185skywagon

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26 Okt 2017 17:40 #4 von smartrobert
Hello 185,

please don't be frustrated.

Currently Jeti is the best System that you can buy :) . But remember it's also a tecnical Hobby, so it is verry important that you become acquainted with the Transmitter Philosophy.

I must admit, the Manual isn't the best. But, most things you will learn intuitive, others you will learn by trying out and the rest you can ask here at this marvellous Forum.

Don't give up,

Robert
Folgende Benutzer bedankten sich: 185skywagon

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26 Okt 2017 18:51 #5 von PW
Hi,

asymetric mixture is in the radio. We fly F3A pattern etc. and we are using it.


Regards
PW

Rechtsbeistand u.a. bei "Modellflugproblemen"etc. : Rechtsanwälte Wessels & Partner, Tel.: 02362/27065

PW Modellbautechnik ( Jeti Kombiangebote, Beratung/Einstellservice etc.)
Folgende Benutzer bedankten sich: 185skywagon

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27 Okt 2017 00:53 #6 von 185skywagon
Hello everyone.

First of all, thank you so much for your kind responses. I do appreciate it. The purpose of my post, being in the "Comments for Jeti" sub forum was to suggest a couple of basic programing features for people like me who are not yet wizards of the system. I'm not expecting a hand out to make it easy for me and I have little doubt that the results I'm looking for (in the programing) can be achieved, just not simply. My point is proven in this thread where by you are saying yes you can do that BUT you have to do this and that.
Please understand, I am trying. I do not wish to give up. I have spent countless hours on the radio attempting to program my aircraft, I have gained a lot of knowledge along the way. I'm not extremely intelligent, but this isn't my first day in the hobby either. I have programmed MANY transmitters not only for my self but many other people. I've used and programed a number of different brands and programming philosophies (though never Jeti, up until now) and I have never had the trouble I have had with this. It seems (to me) that if you want to program some of these features you are required to already possess a deep understanding of the system and a degree in the system if you wish to get around some problems. It simply shouldn't have to be that difficult. A couple of menu items for some basic programing features such as flap systems and knife edge mixes (as used by the other major transmitter manufacturers) and other common uses could make it so much simpler to complete basic programing, particularly for new people to the system.
The use of flight modes or the butterfly menu for a basic flap setup, like you guys have suggested, is a prime example of what I'm suggesting in my post. Why should we have to use functions designed for something else, to carry out a simple, extremely common, programing task ? At the moment I have had to use flight modes for flap setup. I had to research this on forums as an effective method of flap setup. I just want to use flight modes for,- flight modes. Now I have flight modes for flight modes, and flight modes for flaps, and hierarchies, and making sure there is no conflict between the modes. I need to set up mixes for the elevator on different the different modes. What a cluster of complexity for such a simple task ! On other transmitters, I go into a flap menu and say I want to use this switch (/slider/knob) to control flaps,- I want this much flap deflection(e.g 10% down) at this switch position, this much (e.g 35%) deflection at switch position 3. At position 1 2 and 3 I want this much elevator compensation. And I want the flaps to travel at this speed. I program all these basic things in one menu. SO simple on any other transmitter, its a 30 second program job. It works across all flight modes, and flight modes are left for being,- flight modes. Why can't it be like that on Jeti as well ?

Now in regards to the knife edge mixing, I see a few of you are saying I can do this via the curve. I'm interested as to how to do this. I have researched what I'm after and have found a lot of people have the same problems but not found any easy solutions. Perhaps some of you could educate me here ?
My understanding of basic function curves relates to the function of the output of the channel in relation to the input requested by the user. For example, linear and exponential curves. Are you suggesting should be able to use it for setting up different deflection values for different DIRECTION inputs ? I have played around with the different curves and user defined curve when trying to get the desired result for my knife edge mix. At the present time I have had little luck.
At the moment, in basic setup , I have the free mixes set up as a master value from rudder to elevator (it is currently set up in a standard "V" curve so the elevator travels up deflection both ways) and a master value for rudder to ailerons. Both of these have the same mix output (master value) whether or not the rudder is moved left or right. Thats perfect if its set up for one direction, but I need different values for different directions. What I'm after could be demonstrated in this example:

For LEFT rudder I need 5% up elevator, for RIGHT rudder I need a 10% up elevator.
For LEFT rudder I need 3% right aileron and RIGHT rudder I need 6% left aileron.

On another model I need with LEFT rudder I need 4% up elevator but for RIGHT rudder I need 2% DOWN elevator.

These numbers are not exact, they are just used for example purposes. Obviously I want to be able to adjust these figures easily between test flights to get it right. If any of you are able to advise me on how I can program these values, the simplest way, I would be very appreciative.

I am not giving up yet, but if I can master the model programing and setup before my transmitter sells, then I will keep it. I WANT to keep it, as I said, there are many aspects to the system which I love. But if I can't program various models to do what I want in a simple enough fashion, then it it is no good to me and I will replace it with either a Futaba 18sz, JR 28x, Spektrum DX20 or the new Powerbox core (depending on how it goes!). The more models I get (and add) over the years, I don't want to have to go through the process of learning how to fool the transmitter into getting what I want.

Thank you all for your time and knowledge !!

185

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